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Palestine vs. Palestinian territories
Greyshark09's change of "Palestinian territories" to "Palestine" in the template is problematic for several reasons.
- The legality of the State of Palestine is in dispute. The boundaries are not official, and the UN vote granting non-member observer status does not warrant a change in the title of this article.
- All of the massacres on the list occurred before the vote.
- The use of the phrase "Palestinian territories" was not abolished by the vote.
- The existing "list of massacres in Palestine" refers to those that took place in the Southern Levant after the Bar Kokhba revolt and before the establishment of the British Mandate. --1ST7 (talk) 19:10, 2 June 2013 (UTC)
- As it is right now, the link to "State of Palestine" goes to the list of massacres from the pre-Mandate period and is unrelated to the UN vote. The lists of massacres in this category are organized by era, and they are listed according to the name of the area at the time of the event. There have not been any massacres in the West Bank or Gaza since the UN vote; if there were, then it might be more appropriate to create a "List of massacres in the State of Palestine". However, all of the events on the list took place prior to 2012 and when "Palestinian territories" or simply "West Bank and Gaza" were the most widely circulated terms in use. --1ST7 (talk) 18:14, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
- There is an ongoing discussion at Talk:State of Palestine regarding application of the term "state" instead of "occupied territories" or simply "territories". I'm sorry for reverting you, i guess i was too busy in repairing wikilinks related to State of Palestine. I will not edit war, but take into account that basically Google presented the case to Israeli parliament that now most international organizations switched from "Palestinian Authority" (or "Palestinian territories, Occupied") to "State of Palestine" as it was upgraded to a non-member state status, see here. It doesn't technically matter how much territory it indeed controls and whether it has all state institutions, but the fact is that from UN point of view it has become a state, and Israel + US are a minority position on that issue.Greyshark09 (talk) 18:42, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
- Aside of that i created List of massacres in Ottoman Syria, so technically speaking list of massacres in Palestine should now refer mainly to current state (from November 2012). Luckily for Palestinians, no massacres have occurred there yet.Greyshark09 (talk) 18:42, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
- Thanks for replying. My primary point is that all of the massacres on the list took place before this vote. According to their revision histories, the List of massacres in Israel and List of massacres in the Palestinian territories underwent splits a few months ago so that neither would include any event that took place before they were referred to as such. I think it is best to follow the precedent and not use the phrase "State of Palestine" when referring to a pre-2012 time frame. Hopefully there won't be any more massacres in that area, but if there are, then it would perhaps be a better time to create a "List of massacres in the State of Palestine". --1ST7 (talk) 19:05, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
- We don't have to create "List of massacres in the State of Palestine", but simply rename the "List of massacres in Palestine". It is quiet obvious that there are absolutely no articles structured as "Massacres in <region>", but only "Massacres in <state/province/autonomy>" or "Massacres during <war>". Thus, "List of massacres in Palestine" should refer only to state - the post-2012 state.Greyshark09 (talk) 19:26, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
- All of the articles use the most common terminology at the time of the massacres on the list. Altering the current "List of massacres in Palestine" would leave a hole in the time period, as the List of massacres in ancient Israel covers pre-136, and the "List of massacres in Ottoman Syria" covers from 1517 to 1917. The List of massacres in Palestine covers the period between the two and encompasses the land that makes up the modern State of Israel, the West Bank, and the Gaza Strip. --1ST7 (talk) 19:47, 20 June 2013 (UTC)
There is an article about mass killings in Cambodia, but I see no article called List of massacres in Cambodia. Should this list be created as a stand-alone article, or should it redirect to mass killings in Cambodia instead? Jarble (talk) 00:20, 5 November 2015 (UTC)